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Wikipedia:城市論壇 (技術)

出自維基百科,自由嘅百科全書
 政策 技術 提議 諗法實驗室 雜項 睇晒 
城市論壇嘅技術部係用嚟討論技術問題。如果遇到臭蟲或者請求新嘅功能,請到Phabricator提出,因為開發人員唔能夠保證會睇呢一頁。

常見問題:

  • 伺服器嘅間歇延遲可能會令到篇新文需要幾分鐘時間至會出現,以致監察清單、貢獻同埋頁面歷史/舊檢視有時唔會顯示到非常之近嘅更改。呢個問題我哋而家響度跟進緊。
  • 個搜尋索引有時會脫班,有機會去到幾個星期前有多。由於咁嘅原因,響搜尋度搵到嘅變動未必會即時反映出嚟。
  • 如果全部嘅連結突然間加咗底綫(又或者冇咗條底綫),噉就可能你嘅瀏覽器載入其中一個css時失敗咗。請強制去重載或者繞過你嘅快取
  • 如果你對整你別出心裁嘅簽名係有問題嘅話,可以睇下Wikipedia:點樣修正你嘅簽名
  • 如果你換咗塊皮,但係又唔可以換返嚟,用呢個連結

喺城市論壇技術部嘅新手人兄,喺呢度貼文之前請先閱讀呢啲指引

請喺你嘅留言道加上你嘅簽名用埋時間(打入~~~~或者撳一下編輯工具欄上面嘅簽名掣)。請響最尾道加上新嘅題目。
歸檔



我想問點解{{維基書本}}會係連去英文版嘅?係{{維基書本}}個模定係{{Sister project}}個模預設咗,可以點樣改返去粵語版本。 ——Z423X5C6傾偈2022年7月19號 (二) 03:10 (UTC)[回覆]

用全名嘅就要用wikibooks:yue:;用短字嘅就要用b:Shinjiman 2022年7月19號 (二) 03:45 (UTC)[回覆]
所以將所有「wikibooks:」換哂做「wikibooks:yue:」就得? ——Z423X5C6傾偈2022年7月19號 (二) 03:48 (UTC)[回覆]
b:嘅話就直接啲,因為唔知有冇版係已經用咗呢個模去用呢個參數嘅。建議睇返其它喺Category:跨維基模嘅用法先至好改,改咗嘅就要睇埋Special:WhatLinksHere/Template:維基書,改返好啲參數。 Shinjiman 2022年7月19號 (二) 04:38 (UTC)[回覆]
@Shinjiman我發現就算改做「b:」好似都唔得,係咪因為佢仲喺incubator,變咗跳唔到過去? ——Z423X5C6傾偈2023年5月11號 (四) 13:59 (UTC)[回覆]
彈過去incubator唔算係問題,但每一版有b:開頭嘅全部彈過去有關語言incubator嘅「頭版」就應該係一個問題嚟。 Shinjiman 2023年5月12號 (五) 04:13 (UTC)[回覆]
@Shinjiman係囉,咁所以應該點樣解決? ——Z423X5C6傾偈2023年5月12號 (五) 06:03 (UTC)[回覆]
噉就要報上去Phabricator搵人處理,因為呢個問題已經超出咗粵維做得到嘅範圍 (Interwiki-Interlanguage mapping)。 Shinjiman 2023年5月12號 (五) 06:42 (UTC)[回覆]

點解加咗個鼓勵人翻譯到中文維基嘅功能?

[編輯]

上嚟睇粵文維基發現多咗個功能,如果篇文未有連其他語言,左邊「話」仍會顯示「中文」嘅連結,如果㩒入去,就會開個翻譯工具,引導人將內容翻譯成中文,並喺中文維基發佈。但同一時間,中文維基未見有同類功能,如果篇文未有連其他語言,係唔會叫人翻譯做粵文或者其他語言。

我唔係成日睇住,唔肯定粵文維基社群有冇事前討論過(似乎搵唔到),但呢個功能對粵文維基嘅發展恐怕會有負面影響。一直以嚟,粵文維基有唔少題材因為唔符合中文維基收錄門檻,又或者中文維基冇人關注,而做咗粵文維基獨家文章,有唔少讀者靠搵中呢啲題材而接觸粵文維基。如果鼓勵人翻譯到中文維基,令中文維基都有同一題材嘅文章,除非粵文維基嘅文章做到好詳盡,否則多數人都會傾向睇中文維基,減少粵文維基接觸網民嘅機會。

我諗既然中文維基都唔見有呢個功能,點解唯獨粵文維基會有呢?如果粵文維基社群從來冇同意過,又可唔可以要求取消呢? Hkzense (傾偈) 2023年2月17號 (五) 14:44 (UTC)[回覆]

請檢查係毋係“[[zh:某標題]]”作怪,否則認真大劑!--202.141.212.98討論2023年2月18號 (六) 01:03 (UTC)[回覆]
我都見到(以冇連Wikidata嘅「陰目偵信」做例子,有「英文」同「中文」兩個翻譯連結),之前唔覺,應該係最近新加嘅。登入先至見到,登出咗就見唔到。而中維、英維呢啲大語種都唔見有。估計可能係上頭(基金會)覺得細語種獨有嘅知識應該要畀更多人睇到,所以就鼓勵人將細語種內容翻譯去大語種,喺宏觀角度有佢哋嘅道理,但如果用細語種角度去諗,而家即係喺細語種地頭宣傳叫人幫手貢獻大語種,我覺得係傷害緊細語種。--Alfakwan (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 06:32 (UTC)[回覆]
呢個係ContentTranslation嘅功能之一,早喺2014年已經開始開發,好耐之前推出咗,唔係新功能嚟。H78c67c·傾偈 2023年2月18號 (六) 06:44 (UTC)[回覆]
我跟住個例子睇,喺我度淨係見到 「英文」(喺我度冇 「中文」),撳入去會出翻譯畫面。我喺 「喜好設定」 搵到一個叫 「Access to start a translation, from the contributions page, the language list, and new page creations.」 嘅選項,預設係開着。我都唔贊同咁嘅做法。 Al12si (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 06:48 (UTC)[回覆]
回覆H78c67c:就算個功能推出好耐,但之前一路都冇強加畀人,所以問題關鍵就係佢而家唔知點解由預設關閉改成預設開啟,同埋並唔係所有語種統一去推行,大語種都未有安排改成預設開啟。--Alfakwan (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 06:53 (UTC)[回覆]
@Alfakwan: 我啱啱摷咗一陣,發覺呢個功能相關資料真係少得淒涼。呢個功能似乎叫做「gray link(s) panel」,mw:Content translation/Product Definition/Entry points#Surfacing lacking languages有介紹。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年2月18號 (六) 06:56 (UTC)[回覆]
@Al12si: 睇返2019年嘅commit f171aaa,粵維嗰陣呢個選項嘅預設閂咗嘅。最衰個file太多改動,開唔到個blame嚟睇係邊個改咗佢。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:05 (UTC)[回覆]
揾到喇,係啱啱星期四UTC 08:15 deploy 嘅Change 889656將呢個功能改為預設開着嘅。詳情請睇phab:T304865H78c67c·傾偈 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:09 (UTC)[回覆]
咁大改動都唔放 tech news... ugh... Al12si (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:10 (UTC)[回覆]
呢個task係專為粵維而開,居然完全冇同粵維社群溝通過。--Alfakwan (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:15 (UTC)[回覆]
@Alfakwan:佢哋認為Wikipedia:城市論壇_(技術)/歸檔/2022年6月#Enabling_Content_and_Section_translation_tool_in_Cantonese_Wikipedia算係溝通咗。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:21 (UTC)[回覆]
原來係噉。可能大家對「enable」個定義有落差啦。喺我眼中Content translation已經enable咗畀人用好耐,想用嘅可以自己開嚟用,但佢近期嘅動作係「所有粵維註冊用戶預設開啟」(default enable for all yue wiki registered users),我又唔覺佢舊年6月個通知有提及過會用呢種方式推行。(講明先:我自己未試用過Content translation,一路以為佢只係方便人由其他語言翻譯去粵維,冇諗過會同時叫人由粵維翻譯去其他語言。)--Alfakwan (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 07:38 (UTC)[回覆]
嘩!咁難得有個契機,請有能力及技術保護自己嘅管理員(其實本用户都有啲驚……)順便勸喻維基媒體基金會處理谷歌打壓粵文版維基百科呢個嚴重問題,請睇「https://zh-yue.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:%E5%9F%8E%E5%B8%82%E8%AB%96%E5%A3%87_(%E9%9B%9C%E9%A0%85)#%E8%B0%B7%E6%AD%8C%E7%8E%A9%E5%BC%84%E4%B8%AD%E5%85%B1%E9%86%9C%E8%81%9E%E4%BE%8B%E5%AD%90」及「https://zh-yue.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Universehk#%E9%80%A3%E7%B5%90%E7%B6%AD%E5%9F%BA%E6%95%B8%E6%93%9A」,有齊客觀證據!以前有檔香港傳媒可能會關心……--49.176.167.107討論2023年2月18號 (六) 08:16 (UTC)[回覆]

多謝解釋。我做個簡單小結先:舊年6月WMF曾經通知粵文維基「Enabling Content and Section translation tool in Cantonese Wikipedia」,但未獲粵文維基社群關注,直到今個禮拜四晚WMF安排為全體粵文維基戶口預設開啟「Content and Section translation tool」,而「Content and Section translation tool」入面包含喺文章左側語言清單入面增加「gray link(s) panel」功能,鼓勵用戶翻譯去其他語言(具體語言按照用戶本身瀏覽習慣而定,例如我只係見到中文、Al12si兄只係見到英文、Alfakwan兄就同時見到中英文),而因為「鼓勵用戶翻譯去其他語言」呢個功能可能會為粵文維基帶嚟潛在負面影響嘅疑慮,引發今次嘅討論。

我又有兩條問題 —— 一條民意調查同一條技術問題:

  1. 大家認為「gray link(s) panel」功能應唔應該喺粵文維基預設開啟?
  2. 如果粵文維基社群主流意見認為唔應該預設開啟「gray link(s) panel」功能:
    • 如果技術上有得獨立閂「gray link(s) panel」,可唔可以安排粵文維基預設閂呢個功能,有需要嘅用戶可以自己去開?(唔影響「Content and Section translation tool」其他功能)
    • 如果技術上冇得獨立閂「gray link(s) panel」(綑綁「Content and Section translation tool」),可唔可以安排粵文維基撤回預設開啟成個「Content and Section translation tool」,有需要嘅用戶可以自己去開?

--Hkzense (傾偈) 2023年2月18號 (六) 13:12 (UTC)[回覆]

要預設閂咗呢個功能嘅「無私」原因,係佢專門鼓勵啲生手用户一時興起以此練習,無意間製造錯漏,誤人子弟,同時阻礙正確嘅原文曝光;「中」文版維基百科充斥英譯「中」嘅長篇半機翻垃圾,資深嘅粵文版維基百科編輯者,都唔會噉樣累街坊兼丢自己架。英譯粵作品以Dr. Greywolf嘅最多(亦似乎係最佳……),可以對照。--49.176.167.107討論2023年2月19號 (日) 03:25 (UTC)[回覆]
其實維基媒體基金會嘅職員好明白,內容增長速度減慢嘅主要原因,係政商打手勢力過大,家陣為咗做騷,竟然扮懵,走嚟打僅餘淨土嘅主意,借善男信女之手玩「misinformation」!人心叵測……--49.176.167.107討論2023年2月19號 (日) 03:31 (UTC)[回覆]
我正想報告問題,就見到原來已經討論緊。話說我入去《表演》一版(注意:而家係睇唔返我當時睇到嘅情況),見到零零舍舍得「中文」一個連結,覺得好奇怪,無理由呢個概念只係得中文版。後尾先至搞清楚個連結原來並唔係連去中文版,而係叫人翻譯去中文版,因為篇文未連Wikidata。當我將篇文連過去對應嘅Wikidata項目後,「中文」連結先至變成連去中文版。我認為「第啲話」呢一欄理應純粹擺放已經有其他語言版本嘅文章連結,而唔係擺放叫人翻譯去其他語言版本嘅連結。雖然話翻譯連結用灰色去識別,但如果唔細心睇都唔容易分辨,當見到有個「中文」連結,要望真啲先至知道究竟係代表已經有中文版定只係叫人翻譯去中文版。我唔認同要搞到咁複雜,希望可以為所有人恢復原狀。--XRTIER (傾偈) 2023年2月19號 (日) 09:19 (UTC)[回覆]
本用户之前可能錯怪咗佢哋;話唔定係樂觀到離譜嘅人好心做壞事啫。其實,只要肯認真諗下,都知道唔理係焉啲話,鼓勵人將某篇文由有人打理嘅地方,直譯去冇人打理嘅地方,結果好極有限;當然,睇唔明官話白話文嘅人,未必會見到咁多嚇死人嘅實例。至於人機合一嘅跨國「disinformation」亂象,實在深不可測,應該暫時擱置。--49.176.167.107討論2023年2月21號 (二) 09:58 (UTC)[回覆]

A reply to "Why did you add a function to encourage people to translate to the Chinese wiki?"

[編輯]

Hello Cantonese Wikipedians,

I am Uzoma Ozurumba, a Community Relations Specialist supporting the Language team.

I apologise for our permanently enabling Content and Section Translation to your Wikipedia which surprised you. We announced our plans to permanently enable these tools in your Wikipedia last year, and there was no objection from your community. A minor blocker delayed the enablement until now that the tool is enabled.

From your conversation here, I can see you are worried about this enablement in your Wikipedia. I want to explain that Content translation already exists as a beta feature in your Wikipedia, but now it can be discovered by more contributors. However, users not interested in the translation tool can disable it from their preferences.

The Section translation tool is an improvement of the Content translation that allows translators to easily translate with their mobile device one section at a time.

Once again, I apologise for this oversight, and I would like to get your feedback and questions about the tool and the enablements.

Best regards UOzurumba (WMF) (傾偈) 2023年2月20號 (一) 18:33 (UTC)[回覆]

  • 呢度係粵文維基,淨係睇個名都知,大家寫嘅係粵文,唔係英文。我唔理你哋咩原因,你哋要上嚟呢度講嘢,要有效,唔該你解決你嘅語言問題,至少畀人睇得明,唔係老奉噉貼一大餅英文上嚟好冇?尤其是好似「Content translation tool」事件噉,你哋貼完英文上嚟,大家睇唔明,冇回應,你哋居然當大家同意!你哋唔好再野蠻啲?!
  • This is Cantonese wiki, as the name implies, we're writing in Cantonese, not English. I don't care what your reason is, if you want to communicate with us, you should solve your language problem and write Cantonese, at least let people know what you mean, instead of posting a bunch of English words, okay? Especially in the case of the "Content translation tool", you posted English, people could not understand it, no response, and you took it as an agreement! Please don't be barbaric! (the English sentences are translated by DeepL)
——咪用實際上係錯別字嘅偽本字嚟扠禍粵文。Cangjie6 (傾偈) 2023年7月27號 (四) 06:29 (UTC)[回覆]
你睇唔明就收皮過主laa。 RZuo (傾偈) 2023年9月17號 (日) 11:58 (UTC)[回覆]
粵文係粵維嘅工作語言,英文唔係。喺粵維用粵文天經地義,喺粵維用英文係違反粵維本來嘅環境。我指出呢個問題,你居然鬧我「收皮」「過主」?如果我眞係「睇唔明」,會回應到佢咩?但我睇得明都好,唔代表佢哋有權違反粵維嘅作業語言,然後老奉咁屈大家唔回應就係同意。佢哋有錯,我如實指出嚟,你憑乜嘢鬧我「收皮」「過主」? ——咪用實際上係錯別字嘅偽本字嚟扠禍粵文。Cangjie6 (傾偈) 2023年9月18號 (一) 00:45 (UTC)[回覆]

建議限制使用Content translation tool

[編輯]

唔知而家出聲算唔算遲,我見WMF始終唔肯撤回為粵文維基百科所有用戶「預設開啟」Content translation tool功能,但我覺得呢啲工具真係唔適宜隨便開放畀所有用戶用。最近有篇文由新手用Content translation tool翻譯,質素唔合格。我又發現原來英文維基百科係為Content translation tool定咗規矩:只有「extended confirmed users」(註冊夠30日、編輯夠500次)先至可以用。英文維基百科有咁多人手檢查文章,都定咗一個門檻唔畀新手用Content translation tool,作為細語種嘅粵文維基百科就更加需要。我動議下面兩個決議,希望粵維社群可以有共識,反映畀WMF:

  1. 為粵文維基百科引入「extended confirmed users」,條件係註冊夠30日、編輯夠500次(條件係咪跟到足英維可以再傾),只有粵文維基百科嘅「extended confirmed users」先至可以喺粵文維基百科用Content and Section translation tool
  2. 粵文維基百科預設關閉Content and Section translation tool,非「extended confirmed users」唔可以手動開,而「extended confirmed users」可以手動開

@HkzenseAlfakwanH78c67cAl12siXRTIER 唔知大家點睇。--Yaukasin (傾偈) 2023年7月2號 (日) 03:55 (UTC)[回覆]

對方出嘅牌係:「以前」得到咗默認共識……我方似乎要跟英文版慣例行事,來次投票,強調有「新」動議要求改變現狀,避免將佢定義為「還原」!掌權嗰班人有啲長年扮純情……--49.176.167.107討論2023年7月2號 (日) 07:12 (UTC)[回覆]
題外話:有時真係覺得氣餒;花咁多功夫理解人哋啲陰招,到頭嚟可能只係幫谷歌賺多咗啲廣告費。--49.176.167.107討論2023年7月2號 (日) 08:29 (UTC)[回覆]
第一冇回應可以理解做「默認共識」,都可能係「默認冇共識」,而後者就應該要按兵不動或者保持不變。佢噉樣話「得到咗默認共識」,係老屈。
第二,粵維嘅工作語文係粵文,佢哋根本冇人用過粵維有效嘅工作語文嚟同粵維溝通,一大堆外語撻落嚟,粵維嘅人老奉要處理?佢憑乜嘢擅自認為「得到咗」共識?——咪用實際上係錯別字嘅偽本字嚟扠禍粵文。Cangjie6 (傾偈) 2023年7月2號 (日) 19:17 (UTC)[回覆]
同意唔好自動開着呢個功能俾所有用戶,起碼要有少少經驗先。對我嚟講CX最大問題係周圍有太多「廣告」想人用,但啲機械翻譯係廢嘅(所以卒之停用咗),格式、連結又唔識自動搬,其實只不過係個 glorified side-by-side editor。而家嘅設計搞到新人加入就想人由零開始翻譯篇文,但好多人根本唔識 wikitext 語句,甚至對粵文同百科嘅語調唔熟悉;搞咁多嘢最終要其他人執手尾。實際執行方面,我覺得就算調教到要autoconfirmed都夠——WMF似乎唔鍾意幫細語種加extendedconfirmed(見phab:T336343等)。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年7月7號 (五) 14:38 (UTC)[回覆]
@H78c67c話時話,粵維translate可唔可以開返machine translate?之前用過幾好用,用用吓無咗... ——Z423X5C6傾偈2023年7月7號 (五) 14:53 (UTC)[回覆]
@H78c67c:所謂 glorified side-by-side editor,其實有個名,叫 CAT,係專業人員先識用嘅嘢,佢哋硬推畀普通人其實有啲怪,況且,(根據佢哋喺 Phabricator 點答過我)佢哋連 CAT 係乜都未聽過。 Al12si (傾偈) 2023年7月7號 (五) 20:00 (UTC)[回覆]
@Z423x5c6:你之前係咪用開佢內置嘅 Google Translate,翻譯咗做中文先?閂咗機械翻譯嘅原因係佢哋之前硬推嘅 NLLB-200 出嘅翻譯錯到七彩,@Al12si 同我走去投訴,搞到佢哋索性閂曬啲機翻算。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年7月7號 (五) 22:56 (UTC)[回覆]
@H78c67c我用 NLLB-200 再人手改啊,印象中Google無得譯做廣東話? ——Z423X5C6傾偈2023年7月8號 (六) 04:10 (UTC)[回覆]
噉樣aa4。如果你覺得 NLLB-200 有用嘅話,我估我哋可以叫佢哋開返嘅... 之但係一定一定唔可以預設開俾新人用,otherwise 我無所謂。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年7月13號 (四) 05:04 (UTC)[回覆]
如果可以開返就好啦。無理由因為幾粒老鼠屎,搞到大家都無得用。如果set做confirmed user先用得應該ok? ——Z423X5C6傾偈2023年7月13號 (四) 15:22 (UTC)[回覆]
其實CX促成嘅低質翻譯,影響唔止係噉。除咗要人執手尾之外,WMF其實會集齊啲 sentence pairs 釋出做語料庫mw:Content_translation/Published_translations#Parallel_corpora),執唔切嘅話啲低質翻譯就會自動俾其他 project pick up,然後佢哋會用呢啲低質原料整低質機翻。 H78c67c·傾偈 2023年7月7號 (五) 22:50 (UTC)[回覆]
除咗低質翻譯外,ContentTranslation本身缺陷多多,另一個討論話題「ContentTranslation唔識連Wikidata」都已經提過,翻譯完又唔識連結去翻譯來源嘅Wikidata項目;建議人做翻譯嗰陣又無視對應嘅Wikidata項目已經有粵文版本而照叫人重新翻譯。預設開放畀所有人用係個好錯誤嘅決定。--Espotono (傾偈) 2023年7月10號 (一) 07:20 (UTC)[回覆]
應該對所有人預設為閂咗,不過可以鑲個開關制喺唔顯眼嘅地方;正如喺間屋入面,一般大人唔會擺切肉刀、老鼠藥及通渠水等工具喺兒童玩具側邊,不過未至於要將佢哋鎖起嚟。--49.176.167.107討論2023年7月14號 (五) 18:15 (UTC)[回覆]
唔知點解我收唔到ping通知,好彩都見到個討論。我同意對所有人預設閂(還原到2023年2月中旬之前嘅狀態),亦同意為自己開返個功能加個門檻。而家粵維autoconfirmed只係註冊4日同10次編輯,如果用autoconfirmed做門檻,老實講效果相當有限,不過既然上面討論提到粵維好難爭取另開extendedconfirmed,所以唯有勉強接受用autoconfirmed做門檻。--Hkzense (傾偈) 2023年7月23號 (日) 13:29 (UTC)[回覆]

出現戲劇性嘅發展:當初最大爭議嘅「gray link(s) panel」,隨住Vector 2022嘅全面啟用而變相廢除咗。不過根據上面嘅討論,粵文維基社群要求「Content translation tool唔應該開畀新手用」嘅共識係好清晰嘅,而多數人同意可以用confirmed user做門檻。我覺得可以嘗試反映畀WMF。--Yaukasin (傾偈) 2023年8月11號 (五) 14:49 (UTC)[回覆]

雖然將Vector 2022設成預設外觀係解決咗一開頭提到嘅問題,但今次只可以話係「咁啱得咁橋」,而唔係WMF聆聽粵文維基社群意見後主動撤回。--Hkzense (傾偈) 2023年8月19號 (六) 14:11 (UTC)[回覆]

我見未存檔就繼續講啦。我無意中發現中文維基百科近日已經成功爭取「只有擁有延伸確認權限用戶可以使用內容翻譯功能將頁面釋出到主條目空間」(相關連結),相反雖然早喺舊年粵文維基社群已經有「Content translation tool唔應該開畀新手用」嘅共識,但從未獲進一步跟進,間中仍出現因新手用Content translation 寫到亂七八糟而導致唔少手尾要跟。--Yaukasin (傾偈) 2024年4月18號 (四) 15:11 (UTC)[回覆]

喺維媒負責推普廢粵嘅職員依然唔肯放過我哋喎!各位就算冇登入,只要用流動版睇粵維嘅〈蔡玉玲〉,㩒個“文A”掣,都會發現隨即出現,最顯眼嘅掣係“missing in 中文”,㩒落去就會見到更多唔應該擺喺嗰喥嘅嘢;任何有粵文版同某非中文版而冇中文版嘅作品一律係噉樣。有冇人識得𠺬“Phabricator”再投訴下? 彳山一儿攵辛束 (傾偈) 2024年9月26號 (四) 16:42 (UTC)[回覆]

Dark mode for logged-out users coming soon!

[編輯]

Hi everyone, for the past year, the Web team at the Wikimedia Foundation has been working on dark mode. This work is part of the Accessibility for Reading initiative that introduces changes to the Vector 2022 and Minerva skins. It improves readability, and allows everyone, both logged-out and logged-in users, to customize reading-focused settings.

Since early this year, dark mode has been available as a beta feature on both the mobile and the desktop website. We have been collaborating with template editors and other technical contributors to prepare wikis for this feature. This work included fixing templates and ensuring that many pages can appear with dark mode without any accessibility issues. We would like to express immense gratitude to everyone involved in this. Because so much has been done, over the next three weeks, we will be releasing the feature to all Wikipedias!

Deployment configuration and timeline

  • Tier 1 and 2 Wikipedias: wikis where the number of issues in dark mode when compared to light mode is not significant. These wikis will receive dark mode for both logged-in and logged-out users. Some small issues might still exist within templates, though. We will be adding ways to report these issues so that we can continue fixing templates together with editors.
  • Tier 3 Wikipedias: wikis where the number of issues in dark mode when compared to light mode is significant. These wikis will only receive dark mode for logged-in users. We would like to make dark mode available to all users. However, some wikis still require work from communities to adapt templates. Similar to the group above, these wikis will also receive a link for reporting issues that will help identify remaining issues.
  • Week of July 1: mobile website (Minerva skin) on the Tier 1 Wikipedias (including Cantonese Wikipedia)
  • Week of July 15: desktop website (Vector 2022 skin) on all Wikipedias; mobile website: logged-in and logged-out on the Tier 2 Wikipedias, logged-in only on the Tier 3 Wikipedias

How to turn on dark mode

The feature will appear in the Appearance menu alongside the options for text and width. Depending on compatibility and technical architecture, some pages might not be available in dark mode. For these pages, a notice will appear in the menu providing more information.

How to make dark mode even better!

If you would like to help to make more pages dark-mode friendly, go to our previous message and see the section "What we would like you to do (template editors, interface admins, technical editors)".

Thank you everyone. We're looking forward to your questions, opinions, and comments! SGrabarczuk (WMF) (傾偈) 2024年6月27號 (四) 17:24 (UTC)[回覆]

提議喺你嘅維基百科到使用Google翻譯支援

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粵語維基百科成員大家好!

Google 翻譯啱啱推出咗支援粵語/廣東話嘅機器翻譯。維基媒體基金會語言同產品本地化團隊建議外部 API 中提供機器翻譯( MT )支援之後,將佢引入到你嘅維基百科內容同章節翻譯工具入面。由於呢個係你維基百科提出嘅第一個機器翻譯支援,我哋想確保佢對你嘅翻譯工作有幫助。為咗達到呢個目的,我嘅團隊希望你嘅社群成員:

  • https://translate.google.com/ 到試下機器翻譯支援。你可以貼上唔同維基百科文章嘅多篇內容,同埋檢查所提供嘅結果係咪一個好 嘅翻譯起點。
  • 為我哋提供有關機器翻譯質素嘅具體意見——話畀我哋知啲翻譯係咪準確、有冇保持原始意思、文法係咪正確,同埋佢哋係咪適合你嘅維基百科。

我哋啟用機器翻譯支援嘅計劃

如果你嘅社群對翻譯支援冇異議,我哋計劃喺外部 API 入面提供機器翻譯支援之後部署。

我哋期待你喺呢個訊息串入面提供意見,因為我哋需要確保我哋會為你嘅翻譯工作提供有用嘅支援服務。多謝你!

UOzurumba (WMF) (傾偈) 2024年7月25號 (四) 16:49 (UTC)[回覆]

Coming soon: A new sub-referencing feature – try it!

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Hello. For many years, community members have requested an easy way to re-use references with different details. Now, a MediaWiki solution is coming: The new sub-referencing feature will work for wikitext and Visual Editor and will enhance the existing reference system. You can continue to use different ways of referencing, but you will probably encounter sub-references in articles written by other users. More information on the project page.

We want your feedback to make sure this feature works well for you:

Wikimedia Deutschland’s Technical Wishes team is planning to bring this feature to Wikimedia wikis later this year. We will reach out to creators/maintainers of tools and templates related to references beforehand.

Please help us spread the message. --Johannes Richter (WMDE) (talk) 10:36, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

Sign up for the language community meeting on August 30th, 15:00 UTC

[編輯]

Hi all,

The next language community meeting is scheduled in a few weeks—on August 30th at 15:00 UTC. If you're interested in joining, you can sign up on this wiki page.

This participant-driven meeting will focus on sharing language-specific updates related to various projects, discussing technical issues related to language wikis, and working together to find possible solutions. For example, in the last meeting, topics included the Language Converter, the state of language research, updates on the Incubator conversations, and technical challenges around external links not working with special characters on Bengali sites.

Do you have any ideas for topics to share technical updates or discuss challenges? Please add agenda items to the document here and reach out to ssethi(__AT__)wikimedia.org. We look forward to your participation!

MediaWiki message delivery (傾偈) 2024年8月22號 (四) 23:20 (UTC)[回覆]

翻譯功能亂譯引模

[編輯]

喺度單聲,翻譯功能近兩日似乎開始亂咁譯引模​​引模名、參數名、作者名、書名,乜都譯。有啲嘢可以用跳轉同喺引模 work around,但係我覺得連作者名、書名都譯好有問題(尤其係當佢連好似 「鴉片」 咁嘅普通名詞都可以譯錯),所以已經喺 Phabricator 報咗(T374689),但係以我經驗根本唔會有人理。如果有人認為呢個係問題,歡迎喺嗰便出聲。 Al12si (傾偈) 2024年9月13號 (五) 08:22 (UTC)[回覆]

Timeless theme

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個 theme 突然死咗,而今揀 Timeless 唔知出咗乜嘢(可能係 Vector)。有冇人知乜事? Al12si (傾偈) 2024年9月14號 (六) 07:28 (UTC)[回覆]

[編輯]
Apologies for cross-posting in English. Please consider translating this message.

Hello everyone, a small change will soon be coming to the user-interface of your Wikimedia project. The Wikidata item sitelink currently found under the General section of the Tools sidebar menu will move into the In Other Projects section.

We would like the Wiki communities feedback so please let us know or ask questions on the Discussion page before we enable the change which can take place October 4 2024, circa 15:00 UTC+2. More information can be found on the project page.

We welcome your feedback and questions.
MediaWiki message delivery (傾偈) 2024年9月27號 (五) 18:57 (UTC)[回覆]

Temporary accounts may be rolled out in late October

[編輯]

My apologies for not using the Cantonese writing. I will be grateful if you translate it, unless English is perfectly fine. I hope it's not too bad.

Hello everyone. We are the Wikimedia Foundation Trust and Safety Product team, working on digital security and online privacy issues. We are here to let you know about temporary accounts for unregistered (logged-out) editors. Later this month, we will be rolling them out on several pilot wikis, who will have the chance to test and share comments to improve the feature before it is deployed on all wikis in mid-2025.

This change is especially relevant to the logged-out editors and the more experienced community members like patrollers and admins – anyone who uses IP addresses when blocking users and keeping the wikis safe.

Based on data we have analyzed, we believe that Cantonese Wikipedia is a great candidate for being a pilot. We wanted to share more about what temporary accounts are, what change they bring, why we think you would be a good piloting community, and what we can do together to make sure this change goes smoothly for everyone affected.

Legal mandate for this work

The Foundation’s Legal team requires that we change the ways in which logged-out editors interact with the wikis, and how their personal data is handled. The result is the creation of temporary accounts. We are doing it to keep up with legal changes and with the ways many people expect websites to operate, and to minimize risks to logged-out editors. (See more on the legal aspect in our FAQ and the 2021 update from the Legal team.)

How temporary accounts work

Any time a logged-out user publishes an edit on this wiki, a cookie will be set in this user's browser, and a temporary account tied with this cookie will be automatically created. This account's name will follow the pattern: ~2024-1234567 (a tilde, current year, a number). On pages like Recent Changes or page history, this name will be displayed. The cookie will expire 90 days after the account creation date. As long as the cookie exists, all edits made by this user from this device will be attributed to this temporary account. It will be the same account even if the IP address changes, unless the user clears their cookies or uses a different device or web browser. A record of the IP address used at the time of each edit will be stored for 90 days after the edit. However, only some logged-in users will be able to see it.

What does this mean for different groups of users?

For logged-out editors
  • This increases privacy: currently, if you do not use a registered account to edit, then everybody can see the IP address for the edits you made, even after 90 days. That will no longer be possible on this wiki.
  • If you use a temporary account to edit from different locations in the last 90 days (for example at home and at a coffee shop), the edit history and the IP addresses for all those locations will now be recorded together, for the same temporary account. Users who meet the relevant requirements will be able to view this data. If this creates any personal security concerns for you, please contact talktohumanrights at wikimedia.org for advice.
For community members interacting with logged-out editors
  • A temporary account is uniquely linked to a device. In comparison, an IP address can be shared with different devices and people (for example, different people at school or at work might have the same IP address).
  • Compared to the current situation, it will be safer to assume that a temporary user's talk page belongs to only one person, and messages left there will be read by them. As you can see in the screenshot, temporary account users will receive notifications. It will also be possible to thank them for their edits, ping them in discussions, and invite them to get more involved in the community.
For users who use IP address data to moderate and maintain the wiki
  • For patrollers who track persistent abusers, investigate violations of policies, etc.: Users who meet the requirements will be able to reveal temporary users' IP addresses and all contributions made by temporary accounts from a specific IP address or range ([[Special:IPContributions]]). They will also have access to useful information about the IP addresses thanks to the IP Info feature. Many other pieces of software have been built or adjusted to work with temporary accounts, including AbuseFilter, global blocks, Global User Contributions, and more. (For information for volunteer developers on how to update the code of your tools – see the last part of the message.)
  • For admins blocking logged-out editors:
    • It will be possible to block many abusers by just blocking their temporary accounts. A blocked person won't be able to create new temporary accounts quickly if the admin selects the autoblock option.
    • It will still be possible to block an IP address or IP range.
  • We are and will be working with other users with advanced permissions, like stewards.  With useful feedback from these users, we have updated tools and scheduled deployments around these updates.
  • Temporary accounts will not be retroactively applied to contributions made before the deployment. On Special:Contributions, you will be able to see existing IP user contributions, but not new contributions made by temporary accounts on that IP address. Instead, you should use Special:IPContributions for this.

Why we think Cantonese Wikipedia will be a good pilot

In late October, we aim to deploy on approximately 10 small and medium-sized wikis. The goal is to ensure all critical functionality (patroller workflows, tools etc.) for temporary accounts work as expected. For that to happen, we want to make sure that people are comfortable with the changed functionality. We will do our best to support the piloting communities. After deploying and improving the functionality, we will keep temporary accounts here, and later, roll them out on more wikis.

We have pre-selected potential good pilots based on different factors. For example, we considered the following statistics and technical limitations: numbers of active IPs, editors, admins, IP edits per month, and lack of blockers related to the configuration of a given wiki. Human connections are even more important, and by that, we mean: availability of potential ambassadors and technical members of the respective communities, and communication with affiliates and hubs and their community support projects. Based on all these factors, we believe that Cantonese Wikipedia will be a good pilot.

What we would ask of you and next steps

  • If you'd like to learn more about temporary accounts, please ask! We will gladly address your questions, suggestions, and other thoughts!
  • If you know of any tools, bots, gadgets etc. using data about IP addresses or being available for logged-out users, you may want to test if they work on testwiki or test2wiki. If you are a volunteer developer, read our documentation for developers, and in particular, the section on how your code might need to be updated.
  • If you want to test the temporary account experience, for example just to check what it feels like, go to testwiki or test2wiki and edit without logging in.
  • Tell us if you know of any difficulties that need to be addressed. We will try to help, and if we are not able, we will consider the available options, including not piloting here on Cantonese Wikipedia.

Before we deploy on the first pilots, we will complete some work. This includes creating a new public dashboard presenting the impact of temporary accounts on communities (T357763), building a mechanism which will automatically give the eligible users the right to reveal IP addresses (T327913), and some other tasks.

To learn more about the project, check out our FAQ – you will find many useful answers there. You may also look at the latest updates and subscribe to our new newsletter. If you'd like to talk to me (Szymon) off-wiki, you will find me on Discord and Telegram. Thank you! NKohli (WMF) and SGrabarczuk (WMF) (傾偈) 2024年10月4號 (五) 23:38 (UTC)[回覆]

李小龍

[編輯]

李小龍版喺2024年5月22俾223.197.65.33破壞,但係我復原唔到,因爲「呢次編輯唔取消得,因為咁做會衝突中間嘅編輯。」請問大家有咩計還原?——定格流星 (傾偈) 2024年10月10號 (四) 03:41 (UTC)[回覆]